[amsat-bb] bounces

Burns Fisher burns at fisher.cc
Tue May 27 20:48:18 UTC 2014

Ah, ok.  I was not sure what you had seen before.  I manage a couple
mailing lists for my church; there is a limited number of things you can do
with mailman...one of them is upping the number of bounces before the
bouncer is cut off.  That is a small improvement for a small list, but for
a huge list where people's addresses are changing every day, it is less
good.  And in all cases, the person whose ISP is doing the bouncing still
does not actually get the mail from the aol and yahoo senders.

There is a new mailman which we are using at my church that sends out the
mail as being "from the list on behalf of 'name'".  That seems to work
pretty well, but I suspect our church IT guy grabbed in in early testing
stages and it probably has some drawbacks which we have not seen on a small

Just want to be sure you know that the AMSAT "IT department" (which does
not include me :-) knows about the issue and is trying to figure out the
best course the issue, although I don't know any details.  And while it
should not make you feel any better, the same problem is hitting AMSAT
internal mailing lists.

Burns W2BFJ

On Tue, May 27, 2014 at 3:45 PM, WA6FWF <wa6fwf at sbcglobal.net> wrote:

> Hi Burns,
>    I understand the whys, and that mailman could munge the from, or maybe
> workout a exception with yahoo, maybe maybe not, my frustration is more we
> are in the middle so sending me all these bounce notices or dropping me
> accomplishes nothing.
>   And as you yourself have commented the digest might be a answer but one
> has to be careful or you end up sending the entire digest as a quote...
>   It just seems for the time being bounces could go to "/dev/null" the "
> bit bucket" or "ignored"   until a fix is found rather than suspending
> accounts.
> 73
> Kevin WA6FWF
> On 5/27/2014 12:02 PM, Burns Fisher wrote:
>> Hi Kevin,
>> There was a discussion of this earlier.  It's a combination of the
>> SENDERs ISP and the mailman software used for this list.  The problem is
>> well known and is bothering people across the country.  (The same thing
>> happened with the mailing lists at my church, for example).  The quick
>> description is that aol, yahoo, and a few others started setting a bit in
>> their mail saying "receivers of this mail should check that they really
>> came from aol (or yahoo)."  Well, it turns out that when you send to a
>> mailing list, the list resends it to recipients.  In other words, your own
>> ISP (who is completely innocent) is seeing that the mail does NOT come from
>> aol or yahoo and bounces it.  (Some mail recipients likr gmail find the
>> mail going into their Spam folders instead).
>> So now the mailman software sees the bounce and has to decide what to do.
>>  Usually bounces are caused by full mailboxes or by someone changing their
>> address.  In either case, it is reasonable after a time to remove that
>> address from the list, and that is how mailman is normally set up.  This
>> kind of bounce used to be uncommon (or unknown).  Some other mailing list
>> programs have similar issues; mailbox happens to be the most common
>> troubled list program.
>> Mailman maintainers are developing fixes.  AMSAT's IT master knows of the
>> issue and something will happen when appropriate updates are available.  In
>> the meantime, the best way around this is to switch your mail to digest
>> form for the moment.  You should also be able to re-enable your account.
>>  Check around and see if you have a password, or you can delete and
>> re-create your address as well.
>> 73,
>> Burns W2BFJ
>> On Tue, May 27, 2014 at 2:41 PM, WA6FWF <wa6fwf at sbcglobal.net <mailto:
>> wa6fwf at sbcglobal.net>> wrote:
>>     Like others I have been getting notifications of bounces of BB>me
>>      and lately I noticed a post did not make it in, so today I get this
>>      Your membership in the mailing list AMSAT-BB has been disabled due to
>>     excessive bounces The last bounce received from you was dated
>>     27-May-2014.You will not get any more messages from this list until
>>     you re-enable your membership.  You will receive 3 more reminders like
>>     this before your membership in the list is deleted.
>>       Really? this is the best way to handle a bounce?  My ISP points
>>     the finger at the BB the BB points it at my ISP.
>>     I belong to 4 other groups that send a email direct on each post
>>     with no bounces either way only Amsat-BB seems to have a issue.
>>     So I dunno I guess this may be goodbye guys its been fun... (it
>>     this makes it in)
>>     73
>>     Kevin WA6FWF
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> _______________________________________________
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